Hello AlphaB.

My first suggestion would be to ask RSM Tenon to contact them and make it clear that they should be communicating with them rather than you now.

My second suggestion would be to make it clear to the callers that you are in a protected trust deed, that you have informed them of this previously, and that if they contact you again you will submit a formal complaint to them. Give them RSM Tenon's contact details. If they call again, make the complaint. Banks are required to investigate such complaints promptly and report back to the FSA on them.

Both of these banks have been made aware that you are in a trust deed. It's unfair that their inability to update their own systems promptly is causing you this level of inconvenience.

Just off the phone with a member of LloydsTSB Collections Team. What a joy it was to talk to her... NOT!

Went through the whole story of telling her about me having a protected trust deed, that they have been repeatedly told that I have a PTD. She wanted to know what it was? When I got it? What it means? I told her to contact RSM Tenon and she said that she couldn't as they have no authority. I told her that I have signed a declaration to give them authority to deal with my creditors.

I said that if they continue to call me I would make a formal complaint to LloydsTSB to which she replied 'about what, us trying to get our money back?' I just hung up the phone and I now refuse to talk to them again. I'll be writing my letter of complaint tonight.

Hello AlphaB.

If major national banks cannot educate their frontline debt collection staff about common debt solutions there seems to be a significant problem at their end.

Please let us know how it goes with the complaint. You don't have to write to them by the way, it might be quicker and easier to call them to lodge your complaint.

i had debt with lloyds but never had any hassle from them did have from another debt collecton firm gave them r s m tennon contact number of person dealing with my case ,they repeatedly kept phoning i just gave them information again and said i would be putting in a complaint ,i didnt as they didn't phone back after that the problem with mine was that it was from an english company and they didnt have a clue what a trust deed was

For the first few months after i my trust deed/became protected I got numerous calls from my two major creditors. It was indeed frustrating. I too am with RSM Tenon. I called my trustee contact person and updated her with each call and letter. She contacted them from her side. Eventually after a few months it did all settle but i completely understand how frustrating and intimidating those calls can be. Just give them the basics..
That you are in a trust deed with "whatever company" This is my contact persons name and phone number and tell them to deal with them. The creditors eventually stop the calls.

Thanks for your support, I've just had another call from Santander chasing my first months missed payment, explained that I have protected trust deed. Went through the usual "I don't know what your talking about, what is a protected trust deed? Does that mean you won't pay?" They said they had never heard of a PTD and had not been notified and who could they object to. I gave them the contact details for RSM Tenon, they asked for my "court case reference number" I said I didn't have one as a PTD does not go through the courts, to which she replied if it hasn't gone to court we can stop it.

What are they talking about? I'm sure they would have been notified by RSM Tenon but if they didn't receive their letter can they do anything now?

You can only be polite for so long. Get caller ID and don't answer what you don't recognise. One option it to write a letter giving the contact details of your trustee and send it recorded. That way, they can't say they didn't get it. Anything that comes through the post, post to your trustee. Some of mine chased me for about 6 months before they gave up. If they don't give up, threaten to report them for harrassment.

Or get a recorded message of 'The person you are trying to reach is now in a protected trust deed, thank you'[;)]

Hi AlphaB.

They'll have received notification but it appears internal communication isn't in place. Even if they didn't get anything you are covered by the Edinburgh Gazette advert which also notifies creditors. Please don't worry about this side of things at all.

Any creditor representatives reading - look how much money, time and goodwill can be wasted by poor internal communication and a failure to train your collections staff in the basics of their trade.

Gillian has exactly the right idea, in fact most mobile phones have an option to reject a call with a recorded voicemail message which you can record as gillian has stated, though perhaps an addendum (in a condescending voice?) mentioning that if they don't know what a Trust Deed is then they should bring that up as a training issue immediately with their supervisor, and that further phone calls will be construed as harassment and a complaint made.

Thanks for all your comments, I think it's finally having an effect I'm now on day two without any phone calls and it's wonderful - I'm probably talking to soon and the phone will ring when I submit this lol.

My last call was from LloydsTSB on Sunday morning and I told them that I had a PTD and the just replied "and..."

My response was a little on the sharp side but I reminded them that; they were the one that worked for a financial institution, they shouldn't rely on me to explain what a PTD was, it would be in everyone benefit for them to find out. I suggested a very good internet search engine that they could use and even gave them the address for this forum.

Who knows perhaps they will learn something...

Hi AlphaB.

Sounds like you have single-handedly kicked off a debt solutions training and awareness program at this banks debt collection department!

Hi AlphaB. Hopefully you will have heard the last of them. But if not, please do not hesitate to contact me or your case manager at RSM Tenon and we will get on to them again.

I think you will probably find that somewhere in a totally different part of the bank from the one that is hassling you there will be a person whose job it is to take your name off the "list", and they have obviously taken their time to get around to doing it.

Worth remembering that you are perfectly entitiled to ask for them to stop calling you at all. Simply state that you prefer to deal with financial matters in writing. Advise that you are recording their call, ask for a name and point out that you view further calls as harassment. Unfortunately some callers over-identify with their employer and think they are the company as evidenced by an earlier post 'trying to get our money back' When you are aware of the extent of your difficulties and are making attempts to sort it, you don't deserve to be made miserable too. It is a temporary situation, you are fixing it and it is only money, you are not a criminal or deviant!! I find it helps to set aside specific times in the day to deal with finances, any other time, I won't let the phone drag me into worry and panic.

Knowledge of some of the following might give you confidence in controlling some aspects of your communication with creditors/...

HomeDebt Factsheets
Harassment of people in debt by creditors

Introduction
Harassment of people in debt by creditors or their agents is a criminal offence under the Administration of Justice Act 1970. It is often difficult to know what to do when you feel a creditor is not dealing with your account fairly.

In order for you to identify what activities by your creditors may involve harassment and what can be done about the problem, this factsheet outlines:
1.Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act
2.Office of Fair Trading Code of Guidance
3.How to deal with harassment by your creditors
4.Useful addresses
Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act
ÔÇ£S40 Punishment for unlawful harassment of debtors.

1.A person commits an offence if, with the object of coercing another person to pay money claimed from the other as a debt due under a contract he-
#9702;harasses the other with demands for payment which, in respect of their frequency, or the manner or occasion of making any such demand, or of any threat or publicity by which any demand is accompanied, are calculated to subject him or members of his family or household to alarm, distress or humiliation;
#9702;falsely represents, in relation to the money claimed, that criminal proceedings lie for failure to pay it;
#9702;falsely represents himself to be authorised in some official capacity to claim or enforce payment; or
#9702;utters a document falsely represented by him to have some official character, or purporting to have some official character which he know it has not.
2.A person may be guilty of an offence by virtue of sub-section (1) (a) above if he concerts with others in the taking of such actions as is described in that paragraph, notwithstanding that his own course of conduct does not by itself amount to harassment.ÔÇØ
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Office of Fair Trading Code of Guidance
Many activities could count as harassment. It is important to note that ÔÇ£anything done by a person which is reasonableÔÇØ when trying to recover a debt, is not considered to be harassment. Both the Office of Fair Trading and Trade Associations (run by the credit industry) have produced guidance on what activities may be considered harassment and should therefore be avoided by creditors. The following list is taken from the new Debt Collection Guidance for holders of consumer credit licences.

Creditors are warned by the Office of Fair Trading under the Debt Collection Guidance that the following practices are "considered unfair":

ÔÇ£IT IS UNFAIR TO COMMUNICATE, IN WHATEVER FORM, WITH CONSUMERS IN AN UNCLEAR, INACCURATE OR MISLEADING MANNER.ÔÇØ

This includes:

#9632;Letters that look like court claims
#9632;Not making it clear who the company is or what their role is
#9632;Unhelpful legal language
#9632;Not giving balance statements about the debt when asked
#9632;Contacting you at unreasonable times even when asked not to
#9632;Asking you to contact them on premium rate phone numbers.
ÔÇ£ THOSE CONTACTING DEBTORS MUST NOT BE DECEITFUL BY MISREPRESENTING THEIR AUTHORITY AND/OR THE CORRECT LEGAL POSITION.ÔÇØ

This includes:

#9632;Claiming to work for the court or be a bailiff
#9632;Implying action can be taken that is not legally possible such as implying they could take your property
#9632;Using a business name or logo that implies they are a government body
#9632;Implying that court action has been taken against you when it hasn't
#9632;Implying not paying your debt is a criminal offence
#9632;Threatening to take court action in England if you live in Scotland or the other way round.
ÔÇ£ PUTTING PRESSURE ON DEBTORS OR THIRD PARTIES IS CONSIDERED TO BE OPPRESSIVE.ÔÇØ

This includes:

#9632;Contacting you too frequently
#9632;Pressurising you to sell property or take out more debt
#9632;Using more than one collection company at the same time or not telling you when your debt has been passed to another company
#9632;Pressurising you to pay in full or in large instalments you cannot afford
#9632;Making threatening gestures or statements
#9632;Ignoring disputes about whether you owe the money
#9632;Trying to embarrass you in public or threatening to tell a third party about your debts such as a neighbour or your family.
ÔÇ£ DEALINGS WITH DEBTORS ARE NOT TO BE DECEITFUL AND/OR UNFAIR.ÔÇØ

Examples include:

#9632;Sending letters addressed to ÔÇ£the occupierÔÇØ or discussing the debt with someone without knowing if they are you
#9632;Refusing to deal with an adviser acting on your behalf
#9632;Not accepting reasonable offers or passing on payments you make
#9632;Refusing to freeze action if you dispute the debt.
ÔÇ£ CHARGES SHOULD NOT BE LEVIED UNFAIRLYÔÇØ.

Examples include:

#9632;Claiming collection costs when the original credit agreement didn't allow this to happen and making you think you are legally liable for the costs
#9632;Not putting the specific amounts that can be added for collection costs in the original credit agreement
#9632;Adding unreasonable charges.
ÔÇ£ THOSE VISITING DEBTORS MUST NOT ACT IN AN UNCLEAR OR THREATENING MANNER.ÔÇØ

#9632;Collectors should explain the reason for any visit and give you notice of the time and date they will call
#9632;They shouldn't visit if they know you are ill or vulnerable and if they find you are unwell or distressed they should leave
#9632;They should not come in if you do not want them to and should leave when you ask them to
#9632;They shouldn't visit you at work or somewhere like a hospital.
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How to deal with harassment by your creditors
#9632;The first step is to write to a creditor and outline your concerns about the company's behaviour. Inform them that you are familiar with the terms of Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act and ask that the creditor takes steps to avoid similar occurrences in the future. Tell your creditors how you would prefer to be contacted and ask that they confirm their agreement to this. A letter at this stage may avoid the need to take further action against the company.
#9632;Tell them you are aware of the OFT Debt Collection Guidance and that you will consider making a complaint about their behaviour under the guidance.
#9632;It is usually difficult to persuade the police to prosecute in cases of harassment unless a more serious offence such as violence, fraud or blackmail is also involved. Normally complaints should be made to the trading standards/consumer protection department at your local council. They should investigate whether an offence has been committed and whether prosecution is appropriate. The penalty is a fine of up to £5,000 in the Magistrates Court. Also a conviction is likely to provide evidence that the creditor is no longer a ÔÇÿfit and proper person' to hold a consumer credit licence.
#9632;If Trading Standards will not act it may be worth contacting the Office of Fair Trading directly. The address is at the end of the factsheet. The OFT does not usually take up individual complaints but their Debt Collection Enforcement Team collects information that can be used to take action against creditors who can lose their consumer credit licence.
#9632;The creditor may be a member of a trade association with a code of practice. You could find out if your creditor is a member of a trade association and write to them with your complaint. A code of practice is not legally enforceable but the association may take some action against their members. Details of the main trade associations are at the end of the factsheet under